Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by J.R. » Mon Apr 09, 2018 12:09 pm

I haven't had time to scan all Crown Court lists etc. Does anyone know if the 'not-guilty' pleas have started yet, and if so, where ?
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by aliburns » Mon Apr 09, 2018 12:37 pm

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by richardb » Mon Apr 09, 2018 12:42 pm

Husband and Dobbie are being tried together at the end of next month.

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by aliburns » Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:56 pm

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by J.R. » Tue Apr 10, 2018 1:52 pm

Thanks for the above.

It gets more interesting by the day.
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by richardb » Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:12 pm

Today's revelations:


School ‘warned girl of her name going in press over coach kissing allegations’


A top private school warned a “vulnerable” teenage pupil her name could appear in the press if they dealt publicly with allegations a sports coach kissed her, a court heard.

An alleged victim claims she was given two options by Christ’s Hospital School when her complaint about Ajaz Karim was brought to their attention – for the matter to be handled “very publicly” with her running the risk of being identified, or for him to be asked to leave the school.

Footage of the woman’s police interview was played to Brighton Crown Court on Tuesday as she discussed a series of alleged incidents in around 1992 or 1993 at the prestigious Horsham school in West Sussex.

Karim, 63, of Hammersmith, West London, denies nine charges of indecent assault and one attempted indecent assault against six girls aged 14 to 18 at the school between 1985 and 1993.

He has since worked at Eton College, Queen’s Club, The Hurlingham Club, as well as the London branches of Champneys and Credit Suisse.

During the interview in May 2016, the woman told officers she started having “special (coaching) sessions” with Karim and he kept “name-dropping celebrities” when talking about his work at Champneys
health club.

She said he started giving her massages while she was partially naked, telling police: “When you trust somebody, you go with it. He was a teacher, he was helping me.”

On another occasion he pushed her up against a wall in a boarding house, the court heard.

She said: “He kissed me on my face and then on my mouth. And I couldn’t move my arms because he was holding them.”

The following academic year she said she agreed to let a friend tell the senior management team – headmaster Richard Poulton, deputy head Elizabeth Cairncross and housemaster Bob Sillett – on the condition her name was not given and no action was taken.

She said she felt “ashamed and uncomfortable” and only wanted the matter on record should anyone else come forward in the future. But her friend said the teachers knew it was her and that other complaints had already been made.

Jurors heard how she was asked to speak to Mr Sillett in the evening and write a statement.

She said: “(He told me) I have a choice. We can either go very public. His (Karim’s) name would be dragged through the press. I was told he was married and has a young family.”

But she said there was an implication her name could be published, adding: “It was just completely not what a 17 or 18-year-old who was trying to do the right thing wanted to hear.

“Or (I was told) we can make it known to him that you have come forward and make him resign.”

She said she chose the latter, adding: “I completely put my trust in them (the school) that they had my best interests at heart.”

Afterwards she said she felt “very isolated” when Karim continued to teach her, claiming others were “frustrated” with her when he then left because they had “listened to a load of waffle he had told them”.

She added: “The whole thing was really poorly handled.

“It has taken me a really long time to get my head around it. I have written off a chunk of my life because of my experience.”

Mrs Cairncross – who worked at the school between 1986 and 2000 – described the alleged victim as “vulnerable” and said she was the third girl she was aware of who had complained about Karim.

Giving evidence, the current principal of Wells Cathedral School in Somerset told the court she was Christ Hospital’s designated child protection officer at the time of the allegations but headmaster
Mr Poulton was in charge of safeguarding.

She said she “could not recall” when the first two girls – who spoke to her together – made the complaints but during a meeting staff held with Karim he “strongly denied” the allegations and was
“defensive”.

She said: “My memory is that he was given a disciplinary warning by the headmaster. I can’t recall if I reported it to the child protection services or not. It would be recorded at the school. I don’t know if the school still has these records or not.”

She said after the third complaint was made, Karim was on what would now be described as a “final warning”, adding: “It was regarded it was evidence that his behaviour had in no way changed.

“He was told to leave the school. He was dismissed.”

The trial continues.

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by Avon » Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:29 pm

I think Karim was an ‘unofficial’ house tutor of LHB under Sillett.

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by dsmg » Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:34 pm

I see Sillett has an MBE for charity work. Ironic that the only thing I remember him for during the 8 years I spent at CH was that we were all terrified of him, his temper and his ´tangents`(using a metre ruler to impart corporal punishment on young boys' bottoms).
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by michael scuffil » Wed Apr 11, 2018 5:29 pm

dsmg wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:34 pm
I see Sillett has an MBE for charity work. Ironic that the only thing I remember him for during the 8 years I spent at CH was that we were all terrified of him, his temper and his ´tangents`(using a metre ruler to impart corporal punishment on young boys' bottoms).
And you haven't made a complaint of historic abuse?
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by dsmg » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:13 am

No. Historic sexual abuse is one thing, corporal punishment another. As others have pointed out, corporal punishment was the norm at that time. If every case of the use of the belt, slipper or ruler was reported and considered an offence then there wouldn't be space in our prisons. There were punishments and punishments. I received a few whacks with a slipper for minor misdemeanours but never received the feared and famed at the time belt from Newsome or tangents from Sillett. It does seem incredible that there was no uniformity to the methods used though and that teachers had free election of their ´weapon` of choice and area of anatomy to impart it. Having discussed this with other contemporaries, it seems they had the same fear as me and were also aware of the sadistic tendencies of some teachers. The system of detention was widely used in my time, a shame some teachers didn't use that deterrent more rather than inflicting physical pain on young boys, some of whom could have been scarred for life by the methods used.
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by sejintenej » Thu Apr 12, 2018 9:19 am

dsmg wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:13 am
The system of detention was widely used in my time, a shame some teachers didn't use that deterrent more rather than inflicting physical pain on young boys, some of whom could have been scarred for life by the methods used.
,
Rather ironically, whilst my back, backside and thighs were "well treated" by Kit I only received one detention whilst at CH and served precisely none! The miscreant was Potts (my junior housemaster); some reason I forget my presence in the classroom at the appointed time would seriously affect my duties in the house which would have affected him!
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by VerisonaLaw » Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:48 am

dsmg wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:34 pm
I see Sillett has an MBE for charity work. Ironic that the only thing I remember him for during the 8 years I spent at CH was that we were all terrified of him, his temper and his ´tangents`(using a metre ruler to impart corporal punishment on young boys' bottoms).
The argument however is, did this form of pusiahment fall beyond the realms of reasonable chastisement?

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by michael scuffil » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:06 pm

dsmg wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:13 am
No. Historic sexual abuse is one thing, corporal punishment another. As others have pointed out, corporal punishment was the norm at that time.
So was much else which is now considered abusive. A starlet in a Hollywood studio was expected to act as a 'comfort woman' for important male visitors. Her career depended on her compliance.

It is, though, perfectly clear that many teachers derived sexual gratification from applying corporal punishment: it was the 'legal' form of sex abuse. (And, tacitly, one of the reasons that led to the abolition of corporal punishment.)
It is, of course, almost impossible to prove the motivation of the punisher. Bryan McGee records that he was beaten by CS Lang, the director of music, for trespassing in the Big School organ loft, and noted a manifest erection. But would anyone have believed him then?
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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by Mid A 15 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:39 pm

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Re: Sentence of Peter Webb referred to Court of Appeal

Post by rockfreak » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:41 pm

Corporal punishment may have been par for the course at that time but I agree with Michael Scuffil that some housemasters seemed to take a vicarious pleasure in laying it on while others hardly beat at all. I date from an age when many people in authority seemed to subscribe to the Christian doctrine of original sin: children are born evil little sods so need goodness beaten into them. A savage beating for a minor misdemeanour can leave someone with a seething resentment of authority and society.
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