Quick questions and (maybe) answers Hertford Memories thread

[englishangel]

I think there were whisperings about this when I left (1972) but as I have said before I went my own way and didn't notice a lot about what was under my nose (sorry Kim). I don't think it was in any way official and possibly the poweres that were had no inkling about what was going on. My parents were evangelical Christians and when I was home from Uni would say rather sadly "I don't suppose you are coming to church!".

But there is no-one so evangelical as a "Born again" and I expect that is what Jo was exposed to.

[Jo]

I'm sorry about all of that , Jo, and understand how you well might have justifiably felt angry.But can you define the extent to which the school itself (The Religious Royal and Ancent Foundation) might have been responsible?

I don't know, Kerren. My anger was mostly directed at the people involved, particularly sixth formers who should have had more sense. Funnily enough I don't remember many of the factual details, such as how long it all went on for (months? more than a year?), and how it came to an end (did it burn itself out, or did staff step in?). So I don't know to what extent DR and the staff were aware. I can't believe housemistresses wouldn't have had an inkling of what was going on, but they often weren't the sharpest tools in the box.

I suspect - and I fully accept that this might just be my prejudices showing here - that the staff would gradually have become aware, perhaps not initially of the full extent, but since the excesses were related to Religion, they might have thought it was harmless, or even to be encouraged. If similar things had started happening under the banner of, for example, new age Californian hippyism, that would have been stamped on very promptly indeed.

[Angela Woodford]

Now I try to remember, there was a tiny bit of evangelical flickering the year that I left (1972)

Alex, do you remember you and I quipping that we should set up a counter movement called Hell's Bells? Then there was the agony of 'A' levels and I thought no more about it.

My mother actually wrote to DR the year of the great Billy Graham Crusade at Earls Court (1968, was it?) to tell her that we absolutely should be allowed to go and be Saved. DR's response was characteristically brusque. We were "too young to learn about comparative religion". That may have been the only occasion when I was grateful to DR.

Jo, I can't believe that DR, the Housemistresses and teaching staff didn't know when evangelical Christianity had spread amongst the girls. In an enclosed community, it would have been impossible to keep underground. I venture the suggestion that if it was at the time when Miss Tucker took over from DR and there were other things on which the staff were focussing, they might well have thought that it was a harmless fad which would pass in time.

I can understand Jo's feelings of anger. Were Prayers in House transformed? Poor old Pot would have been completely baffled.

As from the "message from God" that you were really a repressed Christian, Jo, you were perfectly entitled to feel furious. (I've had people annoyingly praying for me at various stages of my life). I wonder why DR/Miss Tucker couldn't have talked to the leading lights of the Movement and asked them about their manipulative behaviour?

[NEILL THE NOTORIOUS]

This is not really "Hertford" of which I know little, but there is a wonderful book, by a chap called Adrian Plass (aged 37 and a quarter) about Evangelical Churches ---- he wanted some chairs moved, in the church, and got one reply "I will see how the Lord Moves" for moving chairs ? it is an hilarious book, with a lot of truthful observations in it !

I believe the Good Lord has a sense of humour -- and giggles at some of our pretensions !

[fra828]

No Prayer Meetings... no Scripture Union or Billy Graham. .

Wasn't there a "revival" in the early 70s, not long after we left? Worship meetings in the Science Block basement? Or did I just imagine hearing about it?

Yes there was. I don't know about the Science Block basement, but there was a very sinister (in my view) and pernicious God Squad movement that ran through the school around that time. It filled up young minds with all sorts of poisonous nonsense such as speaking in tongues, led by people who should have known better. Virtually everyone in my house, except me and a couple of others, was drawn in to some degree.

After one of the meetings, someone came to me and said there had been a message from god at the meeting that although I pretended to be agnostic, I was really a christian but suppressing it. I can't explain how angry I felt at the presumption and impertinence. I don't think it would be too strong to describe it as feeling spiritually raped. Angry? I was f*****g furious

I have vague memories of this , Jo, sounds very nasty, and horrible for you to have been 'picked on' like that. What a negative place Hertford was at that time.... Was it me, the times we lived in, was it always like this? On a brighter note, we were allowed to choose pop songs for a week or so in 8's for morning prayers, (housemistress Mrs Gardiner was compartively forward thinking!) can't remember if they were read or sung! We chose My Sweet Lord, Imagine and someone even suggested The Israelites!

[Fjgrogan]

This could almost form a thread of its own! I nominate 'I Believe' by Jim Reeves!

[NEILL THE NOTORIOUS]

All the posts on this Thread fill me with dismay --
The more I hear about Hertford the more it appears, if only to me, as an awful place for intimidation, psychological punishments and very strange attitudes of the Staff.
Can it be that those who experienced the "Great Transfer" were relieved to be at Horsham, or was it as bad --- because the Staff moved as well ?

Let us hear from those who know !

[Katharine]

Neill, some of us floated by on a cloud of unknowing. I know I accepted most of it as I didn't know anything else, I did have problems with my Housemistress and always felt a bit of an outsider but don't think it scarred me for ever!

[Fjgrogan]

Neill, there were very few of the staff who made the transfer from Hertford to Horsham in 1985 when CHAOS happened (Christ's Hospital Amalgamation of Schools - or was it Sexes?).

[NEILL THE NOTORIOUS]

But my question endeavoured to find out what the "Transferees" thought about the new environment, did they find it so different ? what was good --- what was bad ?
The Geriatrics among us, only remember Schools which have long since disappeared (Read the nostalgic Posts !) and will, of course, never return,---- but I would still like to know more about the "Change"
Pray tell ---

[Fjgrogan]

I can only speak at second-hand, but will canvass opinion from one or both of my daughters who were involved in the Great Migration from Hertford to Horsham. I do remember two things though. One was a distinct feeling that everyone had to be quickly paired off with someone of the opposite sex, apart from those obvious rebels who deliberately set out to give the impression that they were 'gay' whether or not they actually were. The other memory is of going to the St Matthew's Day service in the City only about a week after the merger, and being so impressed, because it was impossible to tell from the excellent quality of the music that these young people had only been singing together for such a short time.

[cj]

All the posts on this Thread fill me with dismay --
The more I hear about Hertford the more it appears, if only to me, as an awful place for intimidation, psychological punishments and very strange attitudes of the Staff.
Can it be that those who experienced the "Great Transfer" were relieved to be at Horsham, or was it as bad --- because the Staff moved as well ?

Let us hear from those who know !

1. Relief. By 1985, Hertford was so run down and so old-fashioned in outlook that even my mother would comment regularly on it. I don't know how long that had been the case, but I would imagine that once the decision was taken to merge, there was little point in investing money or ideas in a place that was becoming obsolete. I absolutely hated it there, utter detestation, especially at the weekends when there was so little to do that you couldn't take your mind off the awfulness of it. There were few redeeming features (hard-pressed to think of even one now), but we stuck it out (in my case for 2 years) in the knowledge that a utopia (of sorts) was in reach. I know that my parents and those of my friends would not have sent us there if the merger hadn't been on the cards. Few of the staff came with us. Miss Morrison came as joint-ish head and Mrs Thing (Dawson?) from the Art School. Was that it? Everything was new - uniforms, houses, lessons, facilities, opportunities. And of course, B.O.Y.S. Which leads to

2. Excitement. Even though I had a brother, and had been at a co-ed prep school not that long before, the prospect of being within touching distance of the opposite sex was definitely A Good Thing. And not just boys. At the first Chapel service of the new Michaelmas term in 1985, the Grecians looked like MEN. Flutter, flutter, stirring of latent hormones etc. It took a while to, if you'll excuse the pun, 'bed down' but eventually we all got used to each other and it wasn't such a big deal to have to sit next to a boy in class. In my UF and GE (1986-88) I was the only girl in my Mediaeval History GCSE class. Andrew Husband did ask if I wanted to move to be with other females, but I never felt it was a problem, and the boys in my class were absolutely fine with me.

Enough for the moment. I'm having Vietnam-style flashbacks which are requiring alcohol to take the edge off!

(Fjgrogan - looking at your surname, I think your younger daughter might have been on my year.)

[englishangel]

Cath, you have been away a long time. Frances has mentioned Kirri (and Maria) numerous times, babies, and house moves and Christmas and all sorts.

[Fjgrogan]

Yes - sorry about that! I do tend to put too much personal stuff on here!

[englishangel]

Frances, don't apologise, that's what this is for, to catch up and keep up.