Unofficial Christ's Hospital Forum

it looks as if the local media in Somerset care about child abuse, and have done a lot of digging on horrible stories such as this.

https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news/som ... se-1233264

Good for them.

it would be good if anyone with links tipped them off about the former Principal of Well Catherdral Schools' silence re her role with Karim and perhaps others.

Does anyone have the link to the article in which a spokesperson for Wells Cathedral school said Cairncross would not be commenting until after Karim was sentenced - legally erroneous but implying there would by now be a comment??

But there's nothing. I am sure the paper will follow this up.

Is this it:

https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news/som ... 484201.amp

it is - I will email the journo as it is a matter of public interest that she speaks now. Not sure if Safeguarding at Wells Cathedral School can have been up to much if she was in charge. Probably her retirement is a complete coincidence.

This morning is the first time I've read that press report. There is nothing in there that states Cairncross WOULD comment after the sentencing, only that she couldn't until the sentence had been passed.

I hope the journo WILL do a follow up.

Please keep us updated. However, I suspect with a new academic year soon starting, she may dissappear into the mists of anonymity.

The enigmatic title of this thread sounds a bit like a film by the German art director Rainer Werner Fassbinder. One supposes that it might have been promoted by posters showing Cairncross wearing nothing but a black basque and stockings and suspenders.

Does anyone happen to know if Ms. Cairncross made subsequent public statement about not reporting the numerous allegations of criminality against Karim and others to the authorities? I would also be grateful if anyone who can shed light (either positive or negative) about Ms. Cairncross' role at Christ's Hospital vis the catalogue of serious sexual offences that were perpetrated by teachers within her staff and during her tenure there could pm me.

Also, I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester. I do not have any evidence at this point that can prove the veracity of this statement, however, again, if anyone can add anything of substance on this issue, I would be equally grateful if you can pm me in confidence

WiltshireChap wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 pm I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester.

In one way, that would be a very startling claim, because Ms Cairncross didn't become Head of the Cathedral School until 2000, seven years after Peter Ball was publicly disgraced for sexually abusing a male teenager.

In another way it would be less so, because Ball was living in the diocese of Bath and Wells and from 2001 until 2010, troublingly, he had permission to officiate as a priest in that diocese.

Ever Bluer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:04 pm

WiltshireChap wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 pm I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester.

In one way, that would be a very startling claim, because Ms Cairncross didn't become Head of the Cathedral School until 2000, seven years after Peter Ball was publicly disgraced for sexually abusing a male teenager.

Did she ever send housey boys to Ball?
And if so, ever after he received his caution in 1993? It was widely reported at the time in a number of broadsheets I remember specifically.

Ever Bluer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:04 pm

WiltshireChap wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 pm I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester.

In another way it would be less so, because Ball was living in the diocese of Bath and Wells and from 2001 until 2010, troublingly, he had permission to officiate as a priest in that diocese.

Exactly. I don't think you can view Cairncross's actions outside of that...

Pe.A wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:46 am

Ever Bluer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:04 pm

WiltshireChap wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 pm I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester.

In another way it would be less so, because Ball was living in the diocese of Bath and Wells and from 2001 until 2010, troublingly, he had permission to officiate as a priest in that diocese.

Exactly. I don't think you can view Cairncross's actions outside of that...

If children had homesickness wouldn't it have made more sense to send them home?

rockfreak wrote: ↑Sun Apr 19, 2020 9:19 pm

Pe.A wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:46 am

Ever Bluer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:04 pm
In another way it would be less so, because Ball was living in the diocese of Bath and Wells and from 2001 until 2010, troublingly, he had permission to officiate as a priest in that diocese.

Exactly. I don't think you can view Cairncross's actions outside of that...

If children had homesickness wouldn't it have made more sense to send them home?

That's not for me to judge. But to somehow suggest that she was, for lack of a less crude word, pimping pupils out to Ball is just wrong. With regards to Peter Ball, I think better questions should be asked about the way the Police handled the investigation in the early 90s in only handing out a caution. Similarly, one of the things that surprised me in the Ball documentary was the Police only handing out a 12 month probation to one of the priests featured in the documentary (Roy Cotton) in the 50s after he pleaded guilty to exposing himself to an altar boy in a church.

The police didn't hand out a probation order: a court did.

As the offence took place so long ago it is difficult to track down the sentencing powers available to the court at the time.

But whatever the offence it is likely to have be replaced by the offence of Indecent conduct towards young child created by the Indecency With Children Act 1960. That provision created a maximum sentence of two years imprisonment, which will have been reserved for the very worst case.

Sadly a probation order may well have been appropriate given the derisory sentencing powers available to the court at the time.

richardb wrote: ↑Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:57 am The police didn't hand out a probation order: a court did.

As the offence took place so long ago it is difficult to track down the sentencing powers available to the court at the time.

But whatever the offence it is likely to have be replaced by the offence of Indecent conduct towards young child created by the Indecency With Children Act 1960. That provision created a maximum sentence of two years imprisonment, which will have been reserved for the very worst case.

Sadly a probation order may well have been appropriate given the derisory sentencing powers available to the court at the time.

Ok. It certainly sheds light on the way crimes of that nature were viewed by society at the time, especially as you're saying it was 2 years maximum for the very worst cases.

Just out of curiosity though, what was the Indecency With Children Act 1960 replaced by?

The 1960 Act was replaced by the Sexual Offences Act 2003.

The 2003 Act created a host of offences against youngsters. In addition section 1 of the Protection of Children Act 1978 which made possession of indecent photographs of children an offence remains in force.

Pe.A wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:46 am

Ever Bluer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:04 pm

WiltshireChap wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2020 12:22 pm I am led to beleive that whilst principal at Wells Cathderal School subsequently, she was in the habit of sending children who had homesickness or other vunerabilities to stay for a little while with the late Peter Ball, sometime Bishop of Gloucester who was subsequently jailed for a string of predetary seexual assaults on young males during his time at Gloucester.

In another way it would be less so, because Ball was living in the diocese of Bath and Wells and from 2001 until 2010, troublingly, he had permission to officiate as a priest in that diocese.

Exactly. I don't think you can view Cairncross's actions outside of that...

Ball had already gotten in trouble for being a paedo before 2000, but the church still loved and protected him. So anyone sensible who isn't a religious cretin who trusts a church bureaucracy that was corrupt from the very moment it was founded (since CoE only exists so that Henry #8 could get a shag) would have exercised caution. And there certainly would have been rumours floating around (like with Saville) as well as legal information. Now rumours aren't always worth paying attention to, but if there is a rumour about a church man who gets touchy feely around children, it's better to assume it's true than take the risk.


But since CH senior management was exclusively composed of people who valued "reputation" and hobnobbing with medieval relics over the safety of children, they were fine with sending them to someone who was already known to be a molester but still retained his high status and hadn't yet fallen into disgrace.