Roger Martin

This section was setup in August 2018 in order to move the existing related discussions from other sections into this new section to group them together, and separate from the other CH-related topics.

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
wurzel
Deputy Grecian
Posts: 382
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:59 pm
Real Name: Ian
Location: Reading
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 24 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by wurzel » Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:27 pm

J.R. wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:09 pm
harryh wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:05 pm
TMF Good afternoon.
Are you never satisfied with honest statements?
RichardB Good afternoon.
Please explain to me why you thanked TMF for his post.
I really am at a loss here.
Right. "Listen very carefully, I shall say zeees only once !" (God Bless good old British Comedy)

Howard: I have never met you. I have met your son 'The Great Plum'. I greatly sympathise with what you and your family must be going through at this present time. I also admire your posts on here as a recently ex member of staff.

In my view this should NOT be a war, (debate), between staff and OB's. At least you take the time to contribute to the discussion which is more than some retired ex-members of staff have, probably on legal advice.

Quite a few OB's have commented on here on what they experienced at Horsham, as is their right. I was fortunate enough to have departed CH before all the disclosed cases came to light. I am seriously starting to feel guilty that I wasn't there at the time. At least I would have been able to do something, which I would have undoubtably done !!!
Given the general history of this type of abuse I would be totally amazed if there was not a single case during your time at the school or at any other similar institution during any 7 year period last century

User avatar
J.R.
Forum Moderator
Posts: 15754
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 4:53 pm
Real Name: John Rutley
Location: Dorking, Surrey
Has thanked: 380 times
Been thanked: 185 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by J.R. » Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:49 pm

Quite possibly, but I wasn't aware of it at the time, and at the time I wasn't married to Miss Marple who came into my life in the late 60's and is almost a good enough investigator as I am !!
John Rutley. Prep B & Coleridge B. 1958-1963.

TMF
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 120
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:03 am
Real Name: TMF
Has thanked: 167 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by TMF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:28 pm

As far as I am aware the authorities are aware of all sudden departures in the last 27 years. I just do not know how much more reassuring I can possibly be.
Hi Howard,

Thank you for your responses - they are indeed reassuring.

I am not badgering you - but I am again interested in your comment. 27 years takes us back to 1991. Is there a reason that the school would not be aware of sudden departures prior to 1991?

User avatar
Great Plum
Button Grecian
Posts: 5275
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:59 am
Real Name: Matt Holdsworth
Location: Reigate
Has thanked: 103 times
Been thanked: 20 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by Great Plum » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:35 pm

Simply put, Dad started in January 92 as a teacher so can only speak after that date
Maine B - 1992-95 Maine A 1995-99

User avatar
Mid A 15
Button Grecian
Posts: 3112
Joined: Thu May 19, 2005 1:38 pm
Real Name: Claude Rains
Location: The Patio Of England (Kent)
Has thanked: 127 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by Mid A 15 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:35 pm

TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:28 pm
As far as I am aware the authorities are aware of all sudden departures in the last 27 years. I just do not know how much more reassuring I can possibly be.
Hi Howard,

Thank you for your responses - they are indeed reassuring.

I am not badgering you - but I am again interested in your comment. 27 years takes us back to 1991. Is there a reason that the school would not be aware of sudden departures prior to 1991?
I believe Howard is probably referring to the time he was involved on the staff.

Prior to that he probably knows as much as you or me about what has happened since we ceased to be pupils.
Ma A, Mid A 65 -72

TMF
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 120
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:03 am
Real Name: TMF
Has thanked: 167 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by TMF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:54 pm

So the progression is:
The authorities are fully aware.
to
'As far as I am aware the authorities are aware of all sudden departures in the last 27 years. I just do not know how much more reassuring I can possibly be.
to
Simply put, Dad started in January 92 as a teacher so can only speak after that date
to
I believe Howard is probably referring to the time he was involved on the staff.
Prior to that he probably knows as much as you or me about what has happened since we ceased to be pupils.
I am afraid I revise my opinion - I do not think that this is particularly reassuring. There is probably some well intentioned general positioning going on - but I am not getting the impression that people have been attempting to understand this problem, even over the last few years, let alone back into the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Sad.

Jim Rayner
LE (Little Erasmus)
Posts: 56
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:49 pm
Real Name: Jim Rayner
Has thanked: 51 times
Been thanked: 79 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by Jim Rayner » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:56 pm

TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:28 pm
As far as I am aware the authorities are aware of all sudden departures in the last 27 years. I just do not know how much more reassuring I can possibly be.
Hi Howard,

Thank you for your responses - they are indeed reassuring.

I am not badgering you - but I am again interested in your comment. 27 years takes us back to 1991. Is there a reason that the school would not be aware of sudden departures prior to 1991?
Maybe because that's when he joined the staff?

As an impartial observer it looks to me as though you are badgering Howard. You cannot reasonably expect him to know about, or be in anyway answerable for, events that occurred between him leaving the school as a pupil in 1973 and rejoining as a teacher in 1991.

You've also questioned why Howard didn't know about Webb's nickname, which was apparently chanted by most of the school one evening around 1978 or 1979. I have no interest in defending Webb's reputation (in fact I have reason to believe his crimes may be worse than those of which he's been convicted - and yes, I have discussed this with Sussex Police), but I don't believe Webb was known by the nickname 'Pedo' up until I left in 1974, so I'm not at all surprised Howard was similarly unaware of it. The most likely explanation, surely, is that Webb's true character began to emerge in the intervening 4 or 5 years and resulted in him receiving the nickname that we now know he richly deserved.
These users thanked the author Jim Rayner for the post (total 3):
Great Plum (Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:07 pm) • Mid A 15 (Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:16 pm) • Wuppertal (Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:18 pm)
Rating: 17.65%
LHA 67-70; ThA 70-74

User avatar
Mid A 15
Button Grecian
Posts: 3112
Joined: Thu May 19, 2005 1:38 pm
Real Name: Claude Rains
Location: The Patio Of England (Kent)
Has thanked: 127 times
Been thanked: 94 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by Mid A 15 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:58 pm

TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:54 pm
So the progression is:
The authorities are fully aware.
to
'As far as I am aware the authorities are aware of all sudden departures in the last 27 years. I just do not know how much more reassuring I can possibly be.
to
Simply put, Dad started in January 92 as a teacher so can only speak after that date
to
I believe Howard is probably referring to the time he was involved on the staff.
Prior to that he probably knows as much as you or me about what has happened since we ceased to be pupils.
I am afraid I revise my opinion - I do not think that this is particularly reassuring. There is probably some well intentioned general positioning going on - but I am not getting the impression that people have been attempting to understand this problem, even over the last few years, let alone back into the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Sad.
How can anyone comment 'as an expert' (which appears to be what you are expecting) on an era that they have no knowledge of?
These users thanked the author Mid A 15 for the post (total 2):
Great Plum (Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:07 pm) • Wuppertal (Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:18 pm)
Rating: 11.76%
Ma A, Mid A 65 -72

TMF
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 120
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:03 am
Real Name: TMF
Has thanked: 167 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by TMF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:41 pm

From...
The authorities are fully aware.
...to various caveats about time periods and 'as far as I am aware' and what 'I' expect. I was concerned about the statement "There were others." and thought it worth checking if anything were being done about that observation.

I joined the school in 1974 and in 1974 Webb's nickname was Pedo/Paedo - he taught me for 'manual' - we called him Pedo/Paedo.

LHA
Deputy Grecian
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:35 pm
Real Name: Charles Henry
Has thanked: 69 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by LHA » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:43 pm

TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 7:41 pm
From...
The authorities are fully aware.
...to various caveats about time periods and 'as far as I am aware' and what 'I' expect. I was concerned about the statement "There were others." and thought it worth checking if anything were being done about that observation.

I joined the school in 1974 and in 1974 Webb's nickname was Pedo/Paedo - he taught me for 'manual' - we called him Pedo/Paedo.
THat's horrifying TMF. Were other staff aware of this? One assume Webb knew his own nickname too?

TMF
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 120
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:03 am
Real Name: TMF
Has thanked: 167 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by TMF » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:49 pm

As far as I know - everyone knew that Webb's nickname was Pedo/Paedo. When I arrived at the school - from a state school in London - you had to quickly learn the slang - there was no alternative - you would not know what was going on around you if you did not know the slang (and that was dangerous). I was a third form 'squit' (more slang) and most of my contemporaries already knew the slang and nicknames. I believe that masters knew all the nicknames. For example, I once explained to CVS ('Ping') that 'Fallic' (Matthews) had told me to do something. I did not know the meaning of the latter's nickname at the time. CVS understood what I meant and I could tell was checking to see if I knew myself that I was being disrespectful (I simply thought his name was Fallic-Matthews). I subsequently asked someone what the nickname meant - and felt stupid. A similar incident involved awkwardly indicating to Dickie Dawe that I knew what his nickname was. So, yes, in my experience masters knew their own and each others nicknames.

This is why I am so appalled by the dining hall chanting incident. Webb's responsibilities changed after that incident - he did not officiate in the dining hall again - that was a terrible missed opportunity to stop him.
These users thanked the author TMF for the post:
LHA (Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:16 pm)
Rating: 5.88%

CodFlabAndMuck
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:55 pm
Real Name: J Eabnvu
Has thanked: 63 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by CodFlabAndMuck » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:17 pm

TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:49 pm


This is why I am so appalled by the dining hall chanting incident. Webb's responsibilities changed after that incident - he did not officiate in the dining hall again - that was a terrible missed opportunity to stop him.
I just think he was very plausible.
Bizarre as it may seem, why was he invited back for the scouts' summer camp shortly after resigning?
These users thanked the author CodFlabAndMuck for the post:
TMF (Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:19 pm)
Rating: 5.88%

LHA
Deputy Grecian
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:35 pm
Real Name: Charles Henry
Has thanked: 69 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by LHA » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:37 pm

CodFlabAndMuck wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:17 pm
TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:49 pm


This is why I am so appalled by the dining hall chanting incident. Webb's responsibilities changed after that incident - he did not officiate in the dining hall again - that was a terrible missed opportunity to stop him.
I just think he was very plausible.
Bizarre as it may seem, why was he invited back for the scouts' summer camp shortly after resigning?
Gosh, Burr went to scout camps (years after he ''left" on his special boat), did Webb go away with the Scouts too?
These users thanked the author LHA for the post:
TMF (Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:19 pm)
Rating: 5.88%

CodFlabAndMuck
GE (Great Erasmus)
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:55 pm
Real Name: J Eabnvu
Has thanked: 63 times
Been thanked: 55 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by CodFlabAndMuck » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:46 pm

LHA wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:37 pm
CodFlabAndMuck wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:17 pm
TMF wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:49 pm


This is why I am so appalled by the dining hall chanting incident. Webb's responsibilities changed after that incident - he did not officiate in the dining hall again - that was a terrible missed opportunity to stop him.
I just think he was very plausible.
Bizarre as it may seem, why was he invited back for the scouts' summer camp shortly after resigning?
Gosh, Burr went to scout camps (years after he ''left" on his special boat), did Webb go away with the Scouts too?
Yes!

LHA
Deputy Grecian
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:35 pm
Real Name: Charles Henry
Has thanked: 69 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Re: Roger Martin

Post by LHA » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:03 pm

gosh that's just awful it just gets worse and worse, When? Was this Shippen's time or before.
These users thanked the author LHA for the post:
TMF (Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:20 pm)
Rating: 5.88%

Post Reply