Roger Martin - trial
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rockfreak
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
What the hell are cycling shorts parties? We didn't have 'em in the 50s! School's going to the dogs!
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DazedandConfused
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
Have a read back through these posts from Dobbie’s second trial viewtopic.php?f=65&t=5285&hilit=Cycling&start=135
Re: Roger Martin - trial
I found this site via a search for information about the accusations against the unfortunate Roger Martin. I have held back from involving myself in the discussion until now, despite being deeply saddened at the progress of Roger Martin’s case, and deeply angered both by much that has been said about him, and, as I have discovered, about me too.
In registering for this site I had to agree not to post anything ‘abusive… slanderous… hateful…’, yet I find posts referring to myself (as Lt R C Durrant) which are exactly that. As witness the offensive and ignorant post by ‘wagenman’ that I was acquitted of false allegations through ‘even the weakest defence’ and that my trial proves that ‘this time of offending’ is widespread. This does amount to repugnant slander.
I consider it utterly deplorable that the moderator (JR)’s only contribution to that little string is the nasty little witticism, ‘Hello Sailor’.
The one decent and civilised comment, by ‘yamaha’, is passed over as of no merit; whereas it was one which attempted to raise the level of these exchanges out of the gutter.
I have things I want to say about Roger Martin; but first I am going to put a few facts about myself on the record.
1. I came to CH from teaching in a grammar school and as a grammar school boy myself. Ridiculously, it may seem to you all, I found the whole place so formidable that it sucked away all my self-confidence, and I quite quickly became totally ineffective as a teacher. In fact, I didn’t teach, in any real sense. Gradually, not helped by excessive drinking, which was the culture of the Common Room, I stopped trying to teach proper lessons, failed to mark books, and (it’s obvious now) dissolved into a mental breakdown. I just wasn’t coping.
2. The trigger for my ‘sudden departure’ was simple. I was tasked by Roger Martin with the rugby coaching for Barnes A. We had a ‘crunch match’ against LHA and the formidable Dickie Dawe. Just before the game one of my team started playing up a bit and trying to get out of the game. I was very stressed and reacted by trying to call him quickly to order by smacking him around the head. It was, of course, wrong to do so; however, I had experienced the same many times myself at school, and been encouraged to apply the technique in my first job. It wasn’t seen as shocking at the time.
3. A few days later, the School Doctor called for me and informed me that as the result of that misjudged blow the boy had suffered a perforated eardrum, and that he would have to inform the Headmaster. Which he did. Obviously, I was deeply sorry for having caused such an injury to the poor lad, who was a perfectly nice boy, and even after that he was just as before and bore no grudges or resentment. Such a pity!
4. Newsome did as you expect, pontificated about how such irregular punishments were unacceptable and unnecessary in a school where caning was available. (This hardly took into account the fact that the situation had seemed to me to call for immediate action… nevertheless…) The boys’ parents had begged for me to be spared dismissal, but Newsome was adamant. I must resign, and yes, I’d be given a good reference. I’m sure that he seized upon this as a welcome opportunity of getting rid of someone who wasn’t up to it as far as teaching was concerned.
5. Although I didn’t see it at the time, this was a stroke of good fortune for me. It took me a while to pull myself back together; but in due course I became a very good teacher of English to A Level, 1st XV Coach, CCF Contingent Commander, Housemaster, Headmaster. CH was just a bad dream.
6. I did, by the way, inform the Common Room at dinner one evening as to the circumstances of my departure. They were naturally very sympathetic; but also very appreciative of being told the true story, because, as they said, they were so rarely told. Newsome made up some spin about how I was leaving for North Wales because I was ‘passionate about the mountains.’ It was true that I loved the mountains, and became much more so, but it was not the true reason, of course.
So there's one 'sudden departure' for the lynch mob to suck on. I'd hope it would be recorded in the school's documents.
As for that decades later court case that some noxious people want to link to it, I’ll return to that – briefly- and to RM; but this now needs posting.
In registering for this site I had to agree not to post anything ‘abusive… slanderous… hateful…’, yet I find posts referring to myself (as Lt R C Durrant) which are exactly that. As witness the offensive and ignorant post by ‘wagenman’ that I was acquitted of false allegations through ‘even the weakest defence’ and that my trial proves that ‘this time of offending’ is widespread. This does amount to repugnant slander.
I consider it utterly deplorable that the moderator (JR)’s only contribution to that little string is the nasty little witticism, ‘Hello Sailor’.
The one decent and civilised comment, by ‘yamaha’, is passed over as of no merit; whereas it was one which attempted to raise the level of these exchanges out of the gutter.
I have things I want to say about Roger Martin; but first I am going to put a few facts about myself on the record.
1. I came to CH from teaching in a grammar school and as a grammar school boy myself. Ridiculously, it may seem to you all, I found the whole place so formidable that it sucked away all my self-confidence, and I quite quickly became totally ineffective as a teacher. In fact, I didn’t teach, in any real sense. Gradually, not helped by excessive drinking, which was the culture of the Common Room, I stopped trying to teach proper lessons, failed to mark books, and (it’s obvious now) dissolved into a mental breakdown. I just wasn’t coping.
2. The trigger for my ‘sudden departure’ was simple. I was tasked by Roger Martin with the rugby coaching for Barnes A. We had a ‘crunch match’ against LHA and the formidable Dickie Dawe. Just before the game one of my team started playing up a bit and trying to get out of the game. I was very stressed and reacted by trying to call him quickly to order by smacking him around the head. It was, of course, wrong to do so; however, I had experienced the same many times myself at school, and been encouraged to apply the technique in my first job. It wasn’t seen as shocking at the time.
3. A few days later, the School Doctor called for me and informed me that as the result of that misjudged blow the boy had suffered a perforated eardrum, and that he would have to inform the Headmaster. Which he did. Obviously, I was deeply sorry for having caused such an injury to the poor lad, who was a perfectly nice boy, and even after that he was just as before and bore no grudges or resentment. Such a pity!
4. Newsome did as you expect, pontificated about how such irregular punishments were unacceptable and unnecessary in a school where caning was available. (This hardly took into account the fact that the situation had seemed to me to call for immediate action… nevertheless…) The boys’ parents had begged for me to be spared dismissal, but Newsome was adamant. I must resign, and yes, I’d be given a good reference. I’m sure that he seized upon this as a welcome opportunity of getting rid of someone who wasn’t up to it as far as teaching was concerned.
5. Although I didn’t see it at the time, this was a stroke of good fortune for me. It took me a while to pull myself back together; but in due course I became a very good teacher of English to A Level, 1st XV Coach, CCF Contingent Commander, Housemaster, Headmaster. CH was just a bad dream.
6. I did, by the way, inform the Common Room at dinner one evening as to the circumstances of my departure. They were naturally very sympathetic; but also very appreciative of being told the true story, because, as they said, they were so rarely told. Newsome made up some spin about how I was leaving for North Wales because I was ‘passionate about the mountains.’ It was true that I loved the mountains, and became much more so, but it was not the true reason, of course.
So there's one 'sudden departure' for the lynch mob to suck on. I'd hope it would be recorded in the school's documents.
As for that decades later court case that some noxious people want to link to it, I’ll return to that – briefly- and to RM; but this now needs posting.
Re: Roger Martin - trial
I dont think, in and of itself, something like having pupils provide silver service to a group of masters having dinner, dressed in cycling shorts would, strictly speaking, have been illegal. Inappropriate, yes. Illegal, doubt it...DazedandConfused wrote: ↑Sun Jul 07, 2019 4:31 pm I keep coming back to the cycling shorts parties and I’m surprised there haven’t been arrests yet.
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DazedandConfused
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
Of course not. But that’s assuming that’s all they were.Pe.A wrote: ↑Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:28 pmI dont think, in and of itself, something like having pupils provide silver service to a group of masters having dinner, dressed in cycling shorts would, strictly speaking, have been illegal. Inappropriate, yes. Illegal, doubt it...DazedandConfused wrote: ↑Sun Jul 07, 2019 4:31 pm I keep coming back to the cycling shorts parties and I’m surprised there haven’t been arrests yet.
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jtaylor
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
Re this:-
This silence leads to rumour (which was endemic within CH in my time) and their simple view that if they’re silent everything eventually just goes away - and god forbid that Old Blues had a forum within which they could discuss the truth or otherwise. This institutional culture has been changing I think in recent years, but that doesn’t suddenly undo years of secrecy and silence.
I for one applaud RCD for post his story on here - staff being straightforward and clear about what happened in an open forum where they are open to debate and challenge, and will look at moderating carefully any posts to which my attention is drawn with good reason.
Julian
Thanks for your long and informative post. I strongly believe that one of CH’s fundamental problems for many many years is their silence. When the forum started, I met extensive opposition, mostly silent and of which I was only made aware of through the grapevine....
This silence leads to rumour (which was endemic within CH in my time) and their simple view that if they’re silent everything eventually just goes away - and god forbid that Old Blues had a forum within which they could discuss the truth or otherwise. This institutional culture has been changing I think in recent years, but that doesn’t suddenly undo years of secrecy and silence.
I for one applaud RCD for post his story on here - staff being straightforward and clear about what happened in an open forum where they are open to debate and challenge, and will look at moderating carefully any posts to which my attention is drawn with good reason.
Julian
Julian Taylor-Gadd
Leigh Hunt 1985-1992
Founder of The Unofficial CH Forum
https://www.grovegeeks.co.uk - IT Support and website design for home, small businesses and charities.
Leigh Hunt 1985-1992
Founder of The Unofficial CH Forum
https://www.grovegeeks.co.uk - IT Support and website design for home, small businesses and charities.
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jtaylor
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
Incidentally, I have received fairly significant threats in the last couple of years requesting (or requiring!) me to remove posts. I have never done so as the result of threats, and will only do so where there is a good legal or other very strong reason to do so.
One of the problems of simply deleting posts is that it perpetuates the culture of silence, and fuels the conspiracy theorists. I’m always happy to add notes and moderate comments with additional information, or links to refutations, if that feels fair and reasonable to do.
(However, I also do reserve the right to simply delete stuff where I feel it’s being deliberately witch-hunting, baiting, trolling etc too without any justification - or where it’s simply taking up too much time to mediate and moderate - I’m afraid that’s my prerogative!)
One of the problems of simply deleting posts is that it perpetuates the culture of silence, and fuels the conspiracy theorists. I’m always happy to add notes and moderate comments with additional information, or links to refutations, if that feels fair and reasonable to do.
(However, I also do reserve the right to simply delete stuff where I feel it’s being deliberately witch-hunting, baiting, trolling etc too without any justification - or where it’s simply taking up too much time to mediate and moderate - I’m afraid that’s my prerogative!)
Julian Taylor-Gadd
Leigh Hunt 1985-1992
Founder of The Unofficial CH Forum
https://www.grovegeeks.co.uk - IT Support and website design for home, small businesses and charities.
Leigh Hunt 1985-1992
Founder of The Unofficial CH Forum
https://www.grovegeeks.co.uk - IT Support and website design for home, small businesses and charities.
Re: Roger Martin - trial
Thank you for posting.
Why did you decide to move from grammar school teaching to teaching at Christ's Hospital?
Why did you not return to grammar school teaching following your departure from Christ's Hospital?
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rockfreak
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
It's interesting as to which of the national papers publish these court cases. The "Torygraph" (as it's always been known among its own journalists) often runs these court reports whereas the more leftist Grauniad doesn't. And neither do the national TV news channels. I would have thought that the establishment-minded Telegraph might have played down these slurs on our great public school educational system. And why do only ST Coleridge and Barnes Wallis ever get mentioned as old boys? Poets and bombs. What about Lamb, Leigh Hunt, Lambert, Colin Davis, Bernard Levin, Mark Thomas, or, wait for it....Steve Hilton! Yes, let's flag up the boy Hilto a bit more as an example of our illustrious alma mater. I suppose it's all down to the court reporting agency copy that seems to be tediously predictable every time. Anyway, I must defend JR over his comments like "Hello Sailor!" He and I are of a vintage that came up watching TV in a very different and politically incorrect age. "Hello Sailor!" "Ooh you are awful!" "Shut that door!" "Are you free Mr Humphries?" It's taken us a while to get this vaudevillian humour out of our systems and we now find that the modern day feminist movement is even trying to get Finbarr Saunders banned. Shame!
Re: Roger Martin - trial
With regard to my own trial on various charges of assault and sexual assault, this (Thank God!!) was not one regarding allegations of some hideous ‘historical’ offences, which must surely be virtually impossible to disprove, especially given the immensely prejudicial climate of suspicion in which we currently live, but allegations regarding events supposed to have happened only a few weeks before they were reported by the school to the police.
They involved 6 boys all aged around 17, and one a bit younger, and all supposed to have happened at/following a drunken (school-sponsored) end-of-term party. And no allegations were made relating to any other incidents during my 5 years at that school.
I had two excellent solicitors provided by my union who worked tirelessly on the case, far beyond the call of duty and their fees, once they were convinced of my innocence, which happened once they had been into the school to interview a large number of pupils whom I referred to them. We were sure we had a strong case; however, the barrister (a late second choice, the preferred man becoming unavailable) said I was ‘outgunned’ by the number of accusers and had better plead guilty and gain remission of time. Obviously, I refused to consider accusing myself of a falsehood, and preferred to go down fighting.
It would not have escaped the jury’s attention that the worst accusations were discredited when the first ‘victim’ to appear admitted that he had made up ‘some’ of his allegations. Or that all of the older boys were closely linked either in their interests (countryside management) or friendships (two had come as ‘best friends’ together from the same prep school, etc, or both. It also became clear that one boy was a principal instigator and that he and I had had a very tumultuous history in the classroom (although the headmaster failed to inform the police of this, giving the boy a glowing reference, which didn’t go down well with the police post-trial).
Prosecution witnesses expected to back up the testimony of the ‘victims’ proved all too honest, and in one case stated plainly that the accusations of the ‘assault’ he had witnessed were nonsense, and in another a piece of testimony was elicited which proved that key strands in the main accuser’s testimony were lies. Another witness too came out far more favourably in my support that the prosecution had bargained for. And for my own witnesses, a house matron and one of the other boys in the house I was attached were both able to testify to words spoken by one of my accusers that indicated collusion between the group against me.
And so on… Result, unanimous acquittal on all 8 (!) charges after not a very long deliberation.
The school was very fair in allowing us access to interview pupils in search of those whom I might find it useful to call upon. With parents’ consent I was allowed to interview these pupils (many of them) myself, in presence of a senior chaperone, in order to filter and pass on names to my solicitors for formal interviewing.
How much fairer and how very very different from these horrendous ‘historical’ cases, where you wouldn’t have a hope in hell of proving your innocence!
Having thought that that was that and having retired some months later than I had intended (having withdrawn my age-related -60 – notice of resignation when this kicked off), I was later shocked to be summoned out of the blue to appear before the GTCE (initially), ultimately the Teaching Agency to answer on the ‘grounds of probability’ according to the greatly less rigorous standard of proof of ‘civil’ law. Again, although retired, I decided to fight it, for the sake of my reputation, although had had no wish or intention ever to teach again. None of the witnesses against me elected to appear, despite now being around 20 years old and being offered video links. The Disciplinary Panel dismissed the case against me – not a common event! I therefore retained my full status as a qualified teacher.
The fact that I was acquitted not just by the Crown Court but also by a Disciplinary Panel which notoriously seeks any excuse to bar ought to be enough to convince even the vicious cynics on this forum. Furthermore, if they had any shred of decency they would recognise that they have gone well beyond what is acceptable in some of the things thy have said.
They involved 6 boys all aged around 17, and one a bit younger, and all supposed to have happened at/following a drunken (school-sponsored) end-of-term party. And no allegations were made relating to any other incidents during my 5 years at that school.
I had two excellent solicitors provided by my union who worked tirelessly on the case, far beyond the call of duty and their fees, once they were convinced of my innocence, which happened once they had been into the school to interview a large number of pupils whom I referred to them. We were sure we had a strong case; however, the barrister (a late second choice, the preferred man becoming unavailable) said I was ‘outgunned’ by the number of accusers and had better plead guilty and gain remission of time. Obviously, I refused to consider accusing myself of a falsehood, and preferred to go down fighting.
It would not have escaped the jury’s attention that the worst accusations were discredited when the first ‘victim’ to appear admitted that he had made up ‘some’ of his allegations. Or that all of the older boys were closely linked either in their interests (countryside management) or friendships (two had come as ‘best friends’ together from the same prep school, etc, or both. It also became clear that one boy was a principal instigator and that he and I had had a very tumultuous history in the classroom (although the headmaster failed to inform the police of this, giving the boy a glowing reference, which didn’t go down well with the police post-trial).
Prosecution witnesses expected to back up the testimony of the ‘victims’ proved all too honest, and in one case stated plainly that the accusations of the ‘assault’ he had witnessed were nonsense, and in another a piece of testimony was elicited which proved that key strands in the main accuser’s testimony were lies. Another witness too came out far more favourably in my support that the prosecution had bargained for. And for my own witnesses, a house matron and one of the other boys in the house I was attached were both able to testify to words spoken by one of my accusers that indicated collusion between the group against me.
And so on… Result, unanimous acquittal on all 8 (!) charges after not a very long deliberation.
The school was very fair in allowing us access to interview pupils in search of those whom I might find it useful to call upon. With parents’ consent I was allowed to interview these pupils (many of them) myself, in presence of a senior chaperone, in order to filter and pass on names to my solicitors for formal interviewing.
How much fairer and how very very different from these horrendous ‘historical’ cases, where you wouldn’t have a hope in hell of proving your innocence!
Having thought that that was that and having retired some months later than I had intended (having withdrawn my age-related -60 – notice of resignation when this kicked off), I was later shocked to be summoned out of the blue to appear before the GTCE (initially), ultimately the Teaching Agency to answer on the ‘grounds of probability’ according to the greatly less rigorous standard of proof of ‘civil’ law. Again, although retired, I decided to fight it, for the sake of my reputation, although had had no wish or intention ever to teach again. None of the witnesses against me elected to appear, despite now being around 20 years old and being offered video links. The Disciplinary Panel dismissed the case against me – not a common event! I therefore retained my full status as a qualified teacher.
The fact that I was acquitted not just by the Crown Court but also by a Disciplinary Panel which notoriously seeks any excuse to bar ought to be enough to convince even the vicious cynics on this forum. Furthermore, if they had any shred of decency they would recognise that they have gone well beyond what is acceptable in some of the things thy have said.
Last edited by Vilified on Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Roger Martin - trial
The school was threatened with becoming comprehensive, which I didn't fancy; and at that period it seemed that all state schools would go that way; and also a colleague who had previous experience in public schools persuaded me that they were so much better, and that it was the way to go. Big element of snobbery! It was seen as a step up the social ladder.
I made my reputation with extra-curricular pursuits (adventure training, CCF, etc) and didn't really consider returning to state sector. It actually didn't enter my mind. There did seem more scope in public/independent schools.
Re: Roger Martin - trial
Accepted. Same generation as you regards Are You Being Served, etc... and I always enjoyed the humour; however, when the joke is at one's own expense and one has just been vilified (hence my choice of name) and falsely accused it feels a great deal less funny!! I'm sure you can understand my propensity to react strongly.rockfreak wrote: ↑Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:19 pm It's interesting as to which of the national papers publish these court cases. The "Torygraph" (as it's always been known among its own journalists) often runs these court reports whereas the more leftist Grauniad doesn't. And neither do the national TV news channels. I would have thought that the establishment-minded Telegraph might have played down these slurs on our great public school educational system. And why do only ST Coleridge and Barnes Wallis ever get mentioned as old boys? Poets and bombs. What about Lamb, Leigh Hunt, Lambert, Colin Davis, Bernard Levin, Mark Thomas, or, wait for it....Steve Hilton! Yes, let's flag up the boy Hilto a bit more as an example of our illustrious alma mater. I suppose it's all down to the court reporting agency copy that seems to be tediously predictable every time. Anyway, I must defend JR over his comments like "Hello Sailor!" He and I are of a vintage that came up watching TV in a very different and politically incorrect age. "Hello Sailor!" "Ooh you are awful!" "Shut that door!" "Are you free Mr Humphries?" It's taken us a while to get this vaudevillian humour out of our systems and we now find that the modern day feminist movement is even trying to get Finbarr Saunders banned. Shame!
Re: Roger Martin - trial
When you write :
'I found this site via a search for information about the accusations against the unfortunate Roger Martin.'
and
'With regard to my own trial on various charges of assault and sexual assault, this (Thank, God!!) was not one regarding allegations of some hideous ‘historical’ offences, which must surely be virtually impossible to disprove, especially given the immensely prejudicial climate of suspicion in which we currently live...'
Do you believe that Roger Martin was wrongfully convicted?
'I found this site via a search for information about the accusations against the unfortunate Roger Martin.'
and
'With regard to my own trial on various charges of assault and sexual assault, this (Thank, God!!) was not one regarding allegations of some hideous ‘historical’ offences, which must surely be virtually impossible to disprove, especially given the immensely prejudicial climate of suspicion in which we currently live...'
Do you believe that Roger Martin was wrongfully convicted?
Re: Roger Martin - trial
There wouldn't be all the historical cases there are today if there had been a whistleblowing policy and inappropriate behaviour properly dealt with.
If you had not been moved on with a good reference by Newsome, would you have had a long career in teaching?
Would you still retain your status as a qualified teacher had you perforated that boy's eardrum in 2006?
If you had not been moved on with a good reference by Newsome, would you have had a long career in teaching?
Would you still retain your status as a qualified teacher had you perforated that boy's eardrum in 2006?
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J.R.
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Re: Roger Martin - trial
Just out of interest, slightly off topic, but relevant to the subject. I live in Dorking as you know.
Announced this week, a very local private boarding school to me have suspended a teacher over allegations of teacher/pupil indiscretions. Surrey police do not wish to take any action.
School investigation.
Watch this space ????
Announced this week, a very local private boarding school to me have suspended a teacher over allegations of teacher/pupil indiscretions. Surrey police do not wish to take any action.
School investigation.
Watch this space ????
John Rutley. Prep B & Coleridge B. 1958-1963.