Roger Martin - trial

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LHA
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by LHA » Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:44 pm

Vilified wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:34 pm
As I leave the scene, which I gladly do now, a final reminder as to why I involved myself in this highly unpleasant 'exchange of views' in the first place:
1. To quash vicious scurrilous speculation as to my reasons for leaving CH, which were contemptible and deeply offensive;
2. To put on record my own estimation of Roger Martin, who did wrong, I now know, which is horribly sad; but did a vast amount of good to so many also.
I thank those few who have stood up in this forum to acknowledge my honesty and to defend me against the sustained attacks of the self-righteous. It was good to find a just bit of decency and understanding hanging on in there.
HI Vilified.

Please stay on the forum. It is helpful to have the perspective of a teacher from CH in the 1970s in particular.

I was going to ask if at the time of the incident there was ever any concern on your part that the Police would be called (this would obviously happen today) i.e. from the Doctor, Headmaster etc.

Also, when you mentioned that boys pinned a note to your bedroom door, were staff bedrooms accessible to pupils/boys? Where were they. In my time there was a notion that Clive Kemp had a study/bedroom in a boarding house but all other teaching staff had a house/flat in the grounds or elsewhere. M

It would be a valuable insight to continue to have your comments.

Thank you.
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by richardb » Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:51 pm

In the 1970s the junior houses had staff bedrooms next to each dormitory. There was also the flat at the back.

These provided for the tutors.

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Mid A 15
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by Mid A 15 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:57 pm

Maybe I am on my own here but I don't like the tag team baiting Vilified has been subject to at all.

He has answered some rigorous questions fully and expressed contrition. It should stop there.

People rightly want transparency regarding the awful abuse that has blighted CH and to know why it was allowed to happen.

They won't get that if a tag team of online bullies sets to work on new members.

It's unbecoming behaviour if we wish to be part of an inclusive forum.

I'll go back to sleep now.
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Vilified
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by Vilified » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:10 pm

LHA wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:44 pm
Vilified wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:34 pm
As I leave the scene, which I gladly do now, a final reminder as to why I involved myself in this highly unpleasant 'exchange of views' in the first place:
1. To quash vicious scurrilous speculation as to my reasons for leaving CH, which were contemptible and deeply offensive;
2. To put on record my own estimation of Roger Martin, who did wrong, I now know, which is horribly sad; but did a vast amount of good to so many also.
I thank those few who have stood up in this forum to acknowledge my honesty and to defend me against the sustained attacks of the self-righteous. It was good to find a just bit of decency and understanding hanging on in there.
HI Vilified.

Please stay on the forum. It is helpful to have the perspective of a teacher from CH in the 1970s in particular.

I was going to ask if at the time of the incident there was ever any concern on your part that the Police would be called (this would obviously happen today) i.e. from the Doctor, Headmaster etc.

Also, when you mentioned that boys pinned a note to your bedroom door, were staff bedrooms accessible to pupils/boys? Where were they. In my time there was a notion that Clive Kemp had a study/bedroom in a boarding house but all other teaching staff had a house/flat in the grounds or elsewhere. M

It would be a valuable insight to continue to have your comments.

Thank you.
I'll gladly answer those questions, LHA.
1. No, I don't think it ever crossed my mind at any point that there might be any police involvement. It was seen as a purely internal matter by all concerned.
2. Yes, my bedroom was right next door to one of the dormitories, just as my study was right next to the dayroom. There was only a single, unlocked door between the corridor on which my bedroom was located and the dorm. By opening that door, the boys were immediately at my bedroom door or their right, looking down the passage.
3. When I was 'working my time', Roger Martin, realising that my mental state was not good, to get a bit of peace for me, negotiated that I could move into the staff flat at the rear of the house, which had recently become free. This was seen as a very exceptional and privileged arrangement normally granted only to staff of long service, and vey unusual to be given to such a recently appointed teacher.

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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by TMF » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:17 pm

It would be good to know more about...Drinking to excess with colleagues and pupils - when and where this makes sense - any information on that would be much appreciated.

As this thread is long, let me try a short summary (I hope I will not get in trouble again).

We have been educated on:

-Selecting your own name on a forum
-Drinking cultures
-Not teaching
-Assaulting a pupil
-A 'selective' (i.e. false) reference from the headmaster
-Omitted details in a job interview
-Tolerance
-The danger of over simplification
-And an illustrious educational career

Erudite and helpful, really, Vilified. I would like to express my appreciation for Vilified - and I hope that he and everyone can agree that he has seen much support on this forum from many quarters.
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harryh
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by harryh » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:29 pm

Mid A 15 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:57 pm
Maybe I am on my own here but I don't like the tag team baiting Vilified has been subject to at all.

He has answered some rigorous questions fully and expressed contrition. It should stop there.

People rightly want transparency regarding the awful abuse that has blighted CH and to know why it was allowed to happen.

They won't get that if a tag team of online bullies sets to work on new members.

It's unbecoming behaviour if we wish to be part of an inclusive forum.

I'll go back to sleep now.
As usual, Andy, spot on.

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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by wurzel » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:19 pm

Vilified wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:10 pm
LHA wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:44 pm
Vilified wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:34 pm
As I leave the scene, which I gladly do now, a final reminder as to why I involved myself in this highly unpleasant 'exchange of views' in the first place:
1. To quash vicious scurrilous speculation as to my reasons for leaving CH, which were contemptible and deeply offensive;
2. To put on record my own estimation of Roger Martin, who did wrong, I now know, which is horribly sad; but did a vast amount of good to so many also.
I thank those few who have stood up in this forum to acknowledge my honesty and to defend me against the sustained attacks of the self-righteous. It was good to find a just bit of decency and understanding hanging on in there.
HI Vilified.

Please stay on the forum. It is helpful to have the perspective of a teacher from CH in the 1970s in particular.

I was going to ask if at the time of the incident there was ever any concern on your part that the Police would be called (this would obviously happen today) i.e. from the Doctor, Headmaster etc.

Also, when you mentioned that boys pinned a note to your bedroom door, were staff bedrooms accessible to pupils/boys? Where were they. In my time there was a notion that Clive Kemp had a study/bedroom in a boarding house but all other teaching staff had a house/flat in the grounds or elsewhere. M

It would be a valuable insight to continue to have your comments.

Thank you.
I'll gladly answer those questions, LHA.
1. No, I don't think it ever crossed my mind at any point that there might be any police involvement. It was seen as a purely internal matter by all concerned.
2. Yes, my bedroom was right next door to one of the dormitories, just as my study was right next to the dayroom. There was only a single, unlocked door between the corridor on which my bedroom was located and the dorm. By opening that door, the boys were immediately at my bedroom door or their right, looking down the passage.
3. When I was 'working my time', Roger Martin, realising that my mental state was not good, to get a bit of peace for me, negotiated that I could move into the staff flat at the rear of the house, which had recently become free. This was seen as a very exceptional and privileged arrangement normally granted only to staff of long service, and vey unusual to be given to such a recently appointed teacher.
Also note in LhB/A MAb, Pe A/B & ThA with attached masters houses the stairs are towards the centre of the house and all pupils had to pass by an assistant housemasters study to get to bottom of the stairs and then both bottom and top dorm had a bedroom between the stairs and the dorm door - when LhA became a senior house these were moniters studies but in LhB def they were assistant housemasters bedrooms (in 1982 Torkingtons Study was at the bottom of the stairs and I think he was by top dorm, O'Meera had the smaller LhB rear flat, the Flemings had LhA flat (he had just started but she still taught in Brighton) and I think it was Mr Greig ? who had the other LhB junior housemasters room but may have that wrong on the year)

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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by stage crew » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:52 pm

J.R. wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:00 pm
All I can say in reply, vilified, that maybe teaching was not a career for you. Possibly the armed forces ? Even they are taught restraint these days.
This is an unworthy comment, in my opinion.
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by TMF » Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:42 pm

stage crew wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:52 pm
J.R. wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:00 pm
All I can say in reply, vilified, that maybe teaching was not a career for you. Possibly the armed forces ? Even they are taught restraint these days.
This is an unworthy comment, in my opinion.
To me JR's comment conjured up an image of Vilified in charge of a light machine gun. Chillingly humorous. Personally, I think it is wise to be cautious about who you leave in charge of children or weapons. That is just my opinion - please feel free to be as tolerant or intolerant as you desire.

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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by AMP » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:17 am

Vilified wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:34 pm
As I leave the scene, which I gladly do now, a final reminder as to why I involved myself in this highly unpleasant 'exchange of views' in the first place:
1. To quash vicious scurrilous speculation as to my reasons for leaving CH, which were contemptible and deeply offensive;
2. To put on record my own estimation of Roger Martin, who did wrong, I now know, which is horribly sad; but did a vast amount of good to so many also.
I thank those few who have stood up in this forum to acknowledge my honesty and to defend me against the sustained attacks of the self-righteous. It was good to find a just bit of decency and understanding hanging on in there.
I am bewildered that you openly came on a hostile forum to salvage your reputation and express your estimation for a former colleague just convicted of child abuse.

There is no statute of limitations for assault so why post a full confession?

I don't believe for one moment you give a fig what this forum thinks of you.
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J.R.
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by J.R. » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:26 am

stage crew wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:52 pm
J.R. wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:00 pm
All I can say in reply, vilified, that maybe teaching was not a career for you. Possibly the armed forces ? Even they are taught restraint these days.
This is an unworthy comment, in my opinion.
Why ?
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by Foureyes » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:58 am

To JR,
You seem to be assuming the lead in the attacks on Villified, which is way beyond what I understand to be the role of a 'moderator' to be. Indeed, we seem to have reached the stage of asking "who moderates the moderator.?

Be that as it may, you clearly consider that you occupy the high ground where morality, openness and honesty are concerned, so I would be grateful if you would share some of your personal background with us.
First, I understand that you are an ex-policeman, so could you please tell us which forces and for how long?
Secondly,if you were a policeman in the 60s-90s can you assure us that your force never once indulged in gratuitous assaults on suspects or those arrested - the 'resisting arrest syndrome.'
Thirdly, can you give us your assurance that had you come across evidence - or even have heard of it at second or third hand - of a fellow policeman using gratuitous violence you would immediately - without fear or favour, and regardless of whether the (alleged) perpetrator was a friend/colleague - have reported it to your superior?

To save your time, I should make it clear that I am not in any way, shape or form, 'anti-police.' I frequently worked with the police at different levels and in various forces during my career and always got on well with them. I also greatly respect the role they play in society and once had some of the more horrific aspects explained to me by a senior officer. However, I have no doubt that, like any large organisation, there were a few 'bad-hats.' and I also appreciate that ethical standards can change with time.

Nevertheless, your comments on Villified are so constant and becoming so unpleasant that I consider that you need to explain your own authority in such matters with greater clarity.
foureyes :shock:
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by richardb » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:02 am

What has the conduct of others got to do with JR?
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by harryh » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:31 am

richardb wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:02 am
What has the conduct of others got to do with JR?
Hmmm. Myopia?
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richardb
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Re: Roger Martin - trial

Post by richardb » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:32 am

It is about as relevant as saying that teachers at CH have been convicted of sexual abuse so you must be an abuser Howard. And we know that isn't right.

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