Sudanese cuddly toys...

[Wuppertal]

It seems the debating point at the moment so thought I'd bring it up and see what people have on here have to say about it!

Seems rather unfortunate if you ask me, and will increase Islamophobia, even though a huge number of ordinary, righteous, moderate Muslims see the punishment as overreactionary and harsh. Extremists like those who called for this woman's punishment, even going so far as to suggest lashes or being shot, are tarnishing the reputation of Islam which is a perfectly respectful and peaceful major world religion. It's unfortunate that it's only the bad things about this particular religion that ever make the news in the West.

Come on Gordon, make the general opinion more widespread and tell Khartoum exactly what you think, without making your words less blunt for diplomacy's sake. And help get one of our own out of prison. I don't see much of a reason for being diplomatic towards a regime that is commiting unbelievable atrocities in Darfur and still seems to have the time and resources to create pathetic court cases and subsequently send people to prison for giving teddy bears an ill-advised name.

Are there any Muslims on this forum? If so what's your take on this whole situation?

[englishangel]

Sorry, I don't agree.

To our eyes it is harsh and unnecessary but it is only a few days for something that offends a religion. Not the religion of the West but a different religion.

And don't forget we have laws in this country against inciting religious hatred too.

[J.R.]

Who actually named the teddy-bear ?

The teacher in question ?

No - Some Muslim kid, who should rightly be imprisoned and given fourty lashes on his release.

The worlds going mad !

Cut off ALL aid to Sudan, I say. Over £150 million a year, allegedly !

[midget]

A bit insensitive knowing the way those of that persuasion react, but the resulting case was quite unnecessary.

[jtaylor]

Is "God" not big enough to be able to cope with a teddy-bear being named in that way? What "offense" is actually caused?
Is there not the same offense in naming a child "M***"? Especially if that child is ever naughty etc??

Some Christians are often as guilty as anyone else in inappropriately taking offense. By all means expect respect for your religion, but to take offense from something as trivial as this and go marching on the streets about it seems a bit much.....
Just like the Jerry Springer Opera and The Life of Brian being over-reacted about.....

J

[jtaylor]

And, yes, we should withdraw all aid - and all people who are volunteering to help.

One could argue that the school teacher was trying to impose HER values and beliefs of freedom of speech and expresion, but that HER belief was not being respected by them in Sudan! I would hope that if the situation were reversed, we would respect the requirements and beliefs over here and not take offense if none were intended.
We have a muslim employee at work who prays regularly through the day. We have set-aside a room for him to use, and respect his wishes. I wonder if the same would happen in Sudan if we had demanding requirements of our faith?

What do you do when two religions have two different practices which directly offend each other?
i.e. I am offended by the assumption that all men are so uncontrollable sexually, that women should have to cover their faces completely to prevent men lusting after them. But the woman who covers herself has her beliefs, and I respect those and supress my instinctive irritation, and also the lack of courtesy to show your face and mouth whilst speaking to someone.

What a tangled-web....

J

[cj]

Whoever has been teaching the children their equivalent of RE has been doing a pretty cr@p job if they don't already know that it is offensive to name cuddly toys after their prophet.

[Jo]

I'm a bit loath to get involved in this discussion because it pushes all my emotional and irrational buttons, and I'm bound to offend somebody. But I think the whole situation is absolutely outrageous. As a modern world, we accord far too respect, and tolerate far too much nonsense in the name of religion. I'm not saying we should actively disrespect religions, but if religious decrees or practices conflict with the laws of the country, the requirements of a working environment, or with basic human rights, then as far as I'm concerned it's no contest.

The first thing we should do is disestablish the Church of England and separate the church and state. Then, by not favouring one religion, we can't be accused of discriminating all the others by not pandering to every requirement. JT, in some ways it's generous of your employers to set aside a prayer room for your muslim colleague, but why???? What if a Klingon colleague needed to be away from his desk for a couple of hours a day doing religious things? Other people who work conscientiously 8 hours a day end up picking up the extra workload.

It's about time all religions were considered a matter of purely personal choice and not allowed to impinge on the state, the working environment, or anywhere else. You need to pray - do it in your head, or in your own time.

I'd better stop now before I offend the whole forum......

[englishangel]

If we are on religion (of which I have none but did go to a religious foundation) I think a good man once said "render unto Caesar...."

[Wuppertal]

...but it is only a few days for something that offends a religion...

But does it offend a religion? There seem to be many more Muslims who are saying that this case is pathetic and ridiculous than those who are saying it is justified.


And the aid question is difficult. I agree in part with cutting the aid; one could say the same for Burma or Zimbabwe. BUT won't this simply make life worse for the innocent ordinary civilians of the country who lead very difficult and impoverished lives, and rely on aid?

[Mid A 15]

...but it is only a few days for something that offends a religion...

But does it offend a religion? There seem to be many more Muslims who are saying that this case is pathetic and ridiculous than those who are saying it is justified.


And the aid question is difficult. I agree in part with cutting the aid; one could say the same for Burma or Zimbabwe. BUT won't this simply make life worse for the innocent ordinary civilians of the country who lead very difficult and impoverished lives, and rely on aid?

I agree wholeheartedly with your post.

In my opinion we stick any Sudanese diplomats in this country on the first plane back.

Hit the politicians where it hurts by putting the trough where the snouts can't reach.

The truth of the matter though is that we are limited in what we can do without consulting our masters in the EU if we want to remain "good Europeans."

We have a supine foreign office in this country that thinks it's role is to act for the benefit of foreigners.

Some years ago a British police officer, Yvonne Fletcher, was shot dead by a Libyan and our foreign office did sweet fanny adams to get the culprit extradited so that he could stand trial for her murder.

Just be thankful she didn't get 40 lashes and has only got 15 days because our incompetent lot will do nothing to help. Sticking a couple of Islamic Peers on a plane will only increase global warming if you believe man affects it!

[blondie95]

I think this case was blown out of proportion and used as an oppourtunity to attack/make example of the western world.

I do not feel we should cut aid off as there are millions of completely innocent people to this incident who need our help after the atrocities that have happened there.

[marty]

If I buy a teddy for £10, call it Mohammed and then sell it for £20, have I made a prophet?

[J.R.]

I beat you to it on the Jokes page marty !

[marty]

I beat you to it on the Jokes page marty !

Damn it!