Are we alone?

[englishangel]

And where is the next generation of parents going to come from? They are all going to be paying off their student debts, or perhaps they will be regarded as discretionary payments too.

[onewestguncopse]

These stories are very sad but it is a stark reality that the school is losing money at the moment. How we address these losses is not something that is easy to answer but income streams are limited to 1. Parents 2. Old Blue and Other Donors 3. The Endowment. As 3 is stretched to meet the needs at the moment, that leaves 2 and 1. I had a long chat recently to an Old Blue who is close to the school govenrning body and he thinks that it the current level of support offered to parents is frankly unsustainable when the cost of boarding education rises year on year. That is the real challenge that faces the school and its supporters. The past is the past - we must look to the future.

[onewestguncopse]

Another point - the current collapse in share prices and dividend income has also had a major impact on the endowment. Another body blow to sustain.

[YadaYada]

If the school needs more money to sustain its charitable ethos then yes, perhaps it does have to take more full payers BUT it still should NOT be taking so much from others that they cannot survive on what is left.

Does anyone know where they get the 12% figure for mortgage payments? I must admit that I naively thought my mortgage payments would be taken into full consideration and it is this that is really going to make it a struggle for me.

[J.R.]

Maybe the school should be closed and the land sold for development.

Someone, somewhere would make a bob or two.

(........awaits knock on the front door !!!!)

[ReallyMissingHer]

The purpose of the 12.5% of gross income for the mortgage allowance is to stop people taking out huge mortgages in order to reduce school fees which is fair/right/appropriate. We have extend our mortgage term back up to 30 years to ease the pressure (we had got down to a whole 24 years!).

Must be harder on those who rent because around here (scummy part of Surrey) even the cheapest 3 bed is £1,100 per months and 2 bed's flats starts from £850 whereas of course social housing is at least half the price!

[YadaYada]

I didn't expect CH to just pick up my mortgage payments as realise there is a need to ensure that people dont put all their money into their mortgage. However, we live in a terraced house at the bottom end of the housing market and my mortgage is still 25% of my income (and currently has 24 years to go) and I realise now that I didnt really look closely enough in to it.

[ReallyMissingHer]

it's 25% or your gross or net income? We're at the bottom end of the housing market as well - small 3 bed mid terrace (have 4 children) but bought 7 years ago which makes a difference!

All you can do is think about changing your ortgage term & deal or perhaps that you can't afford it?

I think the housing market of the last 6 years has made a huge difference as some people have massive mortgages for bottom end properties, a bit of an anomoly.

Tough decisions

[YadaYada]

It's 25% of my net income. Luckily I never chose to over mortgage so we've had spare money for holidays over the past few years and now this money will quite rightly be diverted to pay for the school fees. Why I question the 12.5% is because I have been very careful and yet could still not buy somewhere cheaper in the area. Extending the mortgage term dovetails with the pension discussion...if I raise it to 30 years I'll be 71 by the time it's paid off. As a teacher in the state system I think I can opt out of the pension contributions that CH count as income but is that really a sensible decision in the long run?

We are only at the beginning of this journey - he starts in September - so I will wait and see. Was a shock to see the assessment of my contribution up £2,500 on the one they sent when we first started the application process.

I hope those of you at the sharp end right now can find a solution x

[fra828]

Charitable foundation? Does it really warrant this status any more?

[jaspersmum]

Charitable foundation? Does it really warrant this status any more?

[lonelymom]

Charitable foundation? Does it really warrant this status any more?

No, it does not warrant its charitable status. The foundation have made it very clear, if you cannot afford the fees your child has to leave. I wish we had known this 2 years ago, would have saved a lot of heartache.

Firstly I have to say that I really, really do sympathise with your situation and I know how hurt and angry I would feel if I was in your position.

But I don't think it's fair to say that CH doesn't deserve it's charitable status because it is clearly still doing wonderful things for those children who it was originally set up to help, including the many children whose parents won't be paying any fees. As onewestguncopse has pointed out, CH is spending more than it receives and isn't getting as much income from it's endowment as before. I too am worrying about how much the fees will be going up, but I don't know what else CH can do to raise funds. I'm sure all the powers-that-be at CH have spent many hours scratching their heads trying to see a way around the problem.

[fra828]

Firstly I have to say that I really, really do sympathise with your situation and I know how hurt and angry I would feel if I was in your position.

But I don't think it's fair to say that CH doesn't deserve it's charitable status because it is clearly still doing wonderful things for those children who it was originally set up to help, including the many children whose parents won't be paying any fees. As onewestguncopse has pointed out, CH is spending more than it receives and isn't getting as much income from it's endowment as before. I too am worrying about how much the fees will be going up, but I don't know what else CH can do to raise funds. I'm sure all the powers-that-be at CH have spent many hours scratching their heads trying to see a way around the problem.

But the thing is : If CH is a charitable school, why should a child who works reasonably hard, is mostly well-behaved and generally settled in the school, have to leave because of financial circumstances? Could BSB (Benevolent Society 0f Blues) not help out in this kind of situation?

Slightly edited by me, to get the quotation insert correct. J.R.

[ailurophile]

Onewestguncopse wrote:

These stories are very sad but it is a stark reality that the school is losing money at the moment. How we address these losses is not something that is easy to answer but income streams are limited to 1. Parents 2. Old Blue and Other Donors 3. The Endowment. As 3 is stretched to meet the needs at the moment, that leaves 2 and 1. I had a long chat recently to an Old Blue who is close to the school govenrning body and he thinks that it the current level of support offered to parents is frankly unsustainable when the cost of boarding education rises year on year. That is the real challenge that faces the school and its supporters. The past is the past - we must look to the future.

I find it somewhat bizarre that the good Burghers of the CH Foundation appear to believe that the school exists in a bubble. Isn't it obvious that the same financial crisis which has hit income stream 3 in the pocket will be having a similar effect on income streams 1 and 2?! Why should it be expected that parents - particularly at CH where most have chosen the school because they could not otherwise afford an independent education for their children - can afford to dig deeper into an already meagre and increasingly overstretched income any more than the Foundation can? And I'm pretty sure that many Old Blues and other donors must be feeling the pinch right now too...

It may well be that the current level of support offered to parents is unsustainable, but does 'looking to the future' justify the Foundation in turning its back on current pupils whose families made choices based on the expectation that this support would be sustained? As far as I can see, CH is even now putting out the same messages to new and prospective parents, and this needs serious consideration before even more pupils are allowed to become 'sad stories'.

[ailurophile]

Lonelymom wrote

Firstly I have to say that I really, really do sympathise with your situation and I know how hurt and angry I would feel if I was in your position.

But I don't think it's fair to say that CH doesn't deserve it's charitable status because it is clearly still doing wonderful things for those children who it was originally set up to help, including the many children whose parents won't be paying any fees. As onewestguncopse has pointed out, CH is spending more than it receives and isn't getting as much income from it's endowment as before. I too am worrying about how much the fees will be going up, but I don't know what else CH can do to raise funds. I'm sure all the powers-that-be at CH have spent many hours scratching their heads trying to see a way around the problem.

Don't forget Lonelymom, it could be you...

Yes, CH is still doing wonderful things for many needy families; but if it can no longer sustain this level of support, presumably this too will have to change. Maybe the school needs to make some difficult choices about whether it can afford to maintain its charitable status, and what the options are if it does not. It's a tough and competitive world in the independent sector right now, and some schools which rely entirely on fees for income have already gone to the wall. We should all be worried.

I wonder whether the Foundation are looking into a solution which could potentially bring in full fee income and remain true to CH's charitable ethos? There is a current move towards encouraging local councils to consider boarding education for children in care, see for example a recent article from The Guardian; http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/200 ... hools-care

Might this be a possible way forward for CH?